Monday, May 26, 2014

My surreal visit to the Apostolic United Brethren, a Mormon polygamist church

I went down to Bluffdale, Utah to the world headquarters of the Apostolic United Brethren. As I mentioned, this is the church that the people from Sister Wives belong to. I have to say, this was unlike any other religious exploration I'd ever done.

Atmosphere:

First off, the city of Bluffdale is between Salt Lake, and another slightly metropolitan area about a half hour south of Salt Lake called Provo. It's a very rural area filled with windmills, strip mines, and miles upon miles of desert landscape. You really do feel like you're in a small city in the middle of nowhere in the area.

Bluffdale is about an hour and a half drive south of where I live. Finding the place proved to be a lot harder than we anticipated, we knew it was near Camp Williams Army Base, but it wasn't obvious. We drove around for a very long time before we finally came upon it from the main road. We turned down a side road that actually turned out to be the road leading there.

When we saw it around the bend, it was more surreal than I expected. I was told this was a ranch. This is was not a ranch, but a compound. There were two main buildings and several smaller buildings, including what looked like a couple of housing units, surrounding the two main ones, and a large parking lot.

Here are the two main buildings:

 
We were unsure which one to go to, so just followed members to the one on the right. I asked someone if this building was opened to the public, he said "Yes," and then quickly sprinted away from us. From my understanding, one of these buildings is the meeting house, and the other is their Endowment House (a substitute temple) used for their Endowment Ceremony (a special and secret ceremony in the Mormon tradition that is believed to endow you with special blessings from God).


This building was their chapel. 


The entry way to the building was a simple foyer with white walls. There was a picture of George Washington praying at Valley Forge. I've seen this painting in many LDS churches and buildings. The significance of this painting to Mormons has never been explained to me, and anyone who can tell me why it's so common, please let me know. Right next to the entrance was a picture of this church's most influential leader, Rulon Allred. The picture was surrounded by a few flower displays. Also along the wall was a picture of Joseph Smith and one of Jesus.

The chapel was a giant gymnasium complete with basketball hoops that were raised up. Towards the front of the gym was a stage. The stage was converted into a pulpit with a podium and several chairs for the leaders of the priesthood and the choir director. To the right side of the stage were pictures of the first three Mormon prophets, Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, and John Taylor. These are the only prophets the AUB honor. Below their pictures was a quote from John Taylor which read, "The Kingdom of God or nothing." To the left of the stage was a picture of Jesus, and right below it was a banner that had a quote from the Book of Mormon.




Overall, the atmosphere was not one designed for function and not aesthetic. I wasn't impressed by the look of it, but it was functional and did have a few personal touches on it.

The People:

This was one group of people who didn't want us there. Only two people talked to us the whole time we were there, and the rest wouldn't even make eye contact with us. They were rather friendly with each other, but not us.

The people were dressed like typical Mormons going to church, long skirts and cap sleeve tops for women, slacks and ties on men. There were a couple hundred of them, and apparently that was about a third of the congregation. The rest were at a funeral for one of the members who had died.

There were a few members that looked like the stereotype of a polygamist with the braids and prairie dresses, but they were a minority. I'm assuming these ones are ones who left the FLDS or similar groups and joined this one.

Most of the members of the congregation were white with a few Latino members. In addition to that, most of the people looked remarkably similar to each other. So many of the young boys were tall, lanky guys with blond hair, and many of the women were similarly built. The ages spanned many generations, from babies to people in their 80's or 90's.

When we first entered the chapel, an elderly gentleman came and introduced himself to us. He then found some other elderly gentleman who looked a lot like Vincent Price in his old age. The old man then proceeded to interrogate us as to why we were there. The first question out of his mouth after he got our names was, "Are you guys LDS?" I told him that I was, but that I left, and my two other friends with me told him no as well. He then asked if we believed in the Book of Mormon. We again answered no. He then asked if we believed in Joseph Smith and modern day prophets. We again said no. He then looked at us with this look of disdain and asked why we would waste our precious time by coming there. We explained that we were just there to see what it was all about. For a moment, it seemed he wasn't going to let us into the chapel, and nearly asked us to leave. At the last minute, my friend Lisa won him over by talking about her Mormon pioneer heritage. This seemed to disarm him and he let us come in, but very reluctantly.

We sat towards the back, and the president of their church, along with several other members sat up on the stage. They kept looking at us, pointing at us, then talking about us. This concerned me a bit, but we played it cool.

Overall, I realized we were not really welcome there. They didn't do anything to make us feel welcome and avoided us in general. People even moved to make sure they didn't sit by us. I've never felt less welcome in any place we've been. The families were big and definitely polygamist families, but they were dressed quite normally for the most part.

The Service:

The service was very similar, yet quite different from an LDS Sacrament meeting. It started with the President of the Priesthood (not just the leader of the local group, but the leader of their whole church) saying a few things. Then announcements were made by several members in the congregation.

After the announcements, a hymn was sung. The hymn was a typical, Mormon hymn called "Come, Come Ye Saints." The hymnals were actually old LDS hymnals from the 40's and 50's that it seemed they had bought in bulk, thus none of the songs were different from any hymns of my childhood. After the hymn a prayer was said, and the President stood up again to speak.

He then said that they would begin the Sacrament by singing a hymn. He looked straight at the three of us and said, "Those who have not been baptized by the hands of this Priesthood, we ask that you do not partake of the Sacrament."

The Sacrament was interesting as it was similar, yet radically different from the LDS version of it. LDS Sacrament services typically use pre-sliced white bread torn into bits and individual, thimble sized cups of water for their communion. Here, they used several full loaves of home baked bread and several glass water glasses to hold the water.

There were a group of about 20 men who passed the Sacrament, and two who blessed it. As they blessed it, they all got on their knees. The two guys who blessed the Sacrament then did something I wasn't expecting and put their arm to the Square. This is a symbol that is very sacred in the Mormon world as it's one of the special gestures used in the temple. The only time I've ever seen this done outside of the Temple is during a baptism, so to see it done for Sacrament was quite shocking. The prayers they used to bless it were identical to the ones of my childhood.

They passed the Sacrament by going row by row giving the people the bread. After all the members had gotten the bread, they asked anyone who hadn't been served to raise their hands. They then went back and had people eat the bread a second time until it was all gone. They then passed the water by taking the glasses to the people and handed it to each of them one at a time. Again, once all the members had been served, they asked if anyone had not been served, then they had the members partake a second time again until all of the water was gone. I liked this part of the tradition of not wasting any of the bread or water, because it used to bother me as a Mormon when I would clean up after Sacrament meeting and they told us to just throw the bread and water out. Their President spoke on this immediately afterward stating that to throw it out would be a dishonor to Jesus and would be like symbolically throwing away his body and blood that had been given up for us.

There was then a speaker. The speeches are given by members, and supposedly impromptu. More on that below. The speech was so insanely boring and long, and only the first speech of the service. We were feeling more and more uncomfortable as time went on and more and more bored. We weren't the only ones bored, everyone was playing on their phones, hunched over, and/or nearly asleep with this speaker. He didn't seem to get them pumped up and inspired.

After he was done, my friends and I sneaked out. We were noticed by everyone, and we weren't sure if they were going to be relieved, offended, follow us out, or all three. They didn't seem happy, and we just wanted to get as far away as possible because we felt very unwelcome there.

Overall, this was the most grueling and uneasy service for me to sit through, it was like a Sacrament meeting of my childhood, but much longer, more boring, and stranger. It was scheduled to go on for two hours, but I have a feeling it would have gone longer as we stayed for only one speech and that went on for 45 minutes after the 30 minute Sacrament portion of the service.

The Message:

This is a hard one to do as the PA system they have was horrible and the room had terrible acoustics. It was hard to understand anything being said. Add to that that the speaker was a man from Mexico with a thick accent and it was even harder to understand what was said. I didn't pay attention to the whole of his 45 minute speech as it required a lot of effort to understand, but he did touch on a few themes.

One of the themes was that the people of the Tribe of Ephraim must go and save the Lamanites in Mexico and elsewhere. Let me explain this one. Mormons teach that the tribes of Israel will gather in Zion, which to them is in the New World and in Jerusalem during the Last Days. As such, Mormons believe they are adopted spiritually into one of the 12 Tribes of Israel and that the tribe they belong to is revealed to them in a special prophecy session most Mormons have done to them in their late teens called a Patriarchal Blessing. Most white Mormons are adopted into the Tribe of Ephraim. Mormons also believe that the current Native Americans, including Latinos, are descended from a race called the Lamanites. They believe the Lamanites were Israelites who came to the Americas and were cursed with darker skin for their sinful ways. Therefore, he was saying that those white people who had been adopted into the Tribe of Ephraim must go and spread the Gospel to the people of Mexico and beyond to bring them back to righteousness.

Another thing he was talking about was the significance of special dates of when the Priesthood was restored and how it coincided with various prophecies. This one was hard to follow and where I spent the least amount of time paying attention as none of it seemed to make sense.

The other thing he said was that it was the goal of their church to go out and purify the LDS Church by actively seeking to convert people in the LDS Church. They believe that the LDS Church is valid, but it must be brought back to the fullness of Truth and that they will be the ones to do it. He stated that they have lots of work to do until the LDS Church fully embraces the Principle (plural marriage) and the United Order (a form of Mormon communism) both of which were once practiced by the LDS Church but later abandoned.

Essentially, he said that we must go out and convert the Lamanites and the Mormons and not rest until they were both brought into polygamy and into agreement with their doctrine and practices.

I wasn't expecting this militant of a message to come from the pulpit. It was all at once horrifying, intriguing, and insanely boring.

Overall Experience:

I can safely assert that after watching that show Sister Wives and seeing this organization that the show Sister Wives is a very polished, well choreographed show to make this group seem more mainstream and progressive than it is. They are not welcoming to outsiders, in spite of saying so, they still have an isolated, compound feel to them even though they are actively engaged in the world, and they are seeking to convert the entire LDS Church into their dogma and belief. They don't seem to be as progressive as the LDS on things like race. While they use modern technology and dress in modern clothing, they are still very much in the mindset of a different time. Try as they want to look like they are part of the mainstream, their lifestyle and radical beliefs will keep them from being so.

In short, this wasn't Sister Wives, it was another Mormon Fundamentalist group in modern clothing.

Additional Notes:

There are some small changes coming to this blog. Stay tuned for more details on that.

Until next time, peace be with you.

99 comments:

  1. I believe those paintings of George Washington are in LDS chapels simply because they were also painted by Arnold Friberg who painted a number of other religious and political paintings - many for the Mormon church. He is a baptized member (now dead).

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    1. The significance is connected to 2 Nephi, 1. The founding of a new nation for the church to flourish. That's what I was told.

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    3. As a former member of this group I can tell you it's because they believe that the US is the promised land that Moses led his people to and that the founding as a country is very significant to their doctrine

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  2. Thanks for your portrait of the AUB. I belonged to that group for a few years in the '90s. It's good to get an outsiders perspective.

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  3. George Washington praying is a metaphor for this country being founded on God and our early leaders being inspired by God to create this country.

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  4. I have to tell you that I found this post fascinating! I grew up in this religion and seeing it from your point of view brought back a lot of memories of visiting (i was from a different state) the building you were at. And I definitely understood, to some extent, how you must have felt.

    I think the unwelcoming-ness of the people is based on fear- polygamy is illegal and (i think) more strictly enforced in Utah. So in this religion's past everyone had to be very secretive about everything to avoid suspicion and possible arrest. I think that secretiveness and fear of arrest still holds true making every outsider, on some scale, a threat. (this is my just my theory as an 'insider/outsider'). The mentality is definitely a far reach from the LDS' 'eager to greet, meet and possibly convert' mentality, huh?!

    And then Sister Wives is definitely not going to give to a true look at the religion. Sister Wives is about one family and as you probably saw there are a lot of contrasts in the families of the AUB.

    But honestly, as a once insider and now outsider, I'd say your observation was pretty on- or at least if fit my memories.

    Can't wait to read more of this blog, it's extremely interesting!

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    1. Thanks for your comment. If you wouldn't mind talking to me, let me know. I'd like to hear more about your experiences growing up in this church.

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    2. I don't know how much help I'd be, but I'm definitely open to talking and answering any questions I can

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  5. Unfortunately, you are very wrong about several things. The president was in fact not present at the meeting at all as he is ill. Secondly, the AUB honors many more LDS prophets than the three on the wall. Thirdly, there are a plethora of people who would have been eager to meet with you after, but because of the circumstances of the funeral there were few people in attendance and morale was down. I was present and did not even see you there - so don't assume everyone wanted you gone. I would have loved to speak with you. Also, your interpretation of the talk is quite odd, as I heard every word and did not hear the themes you speak of. I am sorry you felt unwanted, but you can see why we are hesitant to let just anyone in, because there are always blogs and articles like this one which are misinformed. Come again and I bet you will have an entirely different experience.

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    1. Thank you for letting me know about the president. I also know the AUB honors more prophets, but does feel the LDS Church has fallen away from the fullness of the Gospel, which is more what I was trying to imply with my comments, though I see that wasn't made clear. If you want to talk to me more about your church, I'm more than happy to listen. Email me: smfm3712@gmail.com

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    3. Kayla, I would love to know more about your church. I am LDS and have had the issue of plural marriage weigh on me since I first learned about as a teen. I feel that the principles taught by the first prophets of this dispensation are the purest. Purest from the source. Ya know? Please tell me where I can learn more.

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    5. Can you tell me if there is a AUB group in Germany in Dortmund.

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    6. Can you tell me if there is a AUB group in Germany in Dortmund.

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    7. I'm interested as well in your church, I'm looking for my god. Can you give me any information on how to find a meeting house?

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    8. Hi Kayla, I'm interested in attending a service? When are they?

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  6. Oh my goodness! I come from that group. I am not offended as I am not necessarily part of it anymore but I think this is hilarious and in some respects, accurate. Rest assured some of our other meeting houses are much more accommodating. I think you give yourselves much more credit for being noticed though. There are thousands of people in this group and trust me they don't know and/or notice everyone unless you look and act vastly different.

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  7. Wow... I'm going to have to start following this blog. I was a member of this group in my childhood, and the observations are fascinating. I always wondered as a kid how outsiders saw us, and I sometimes wonder how people would view me if I dropped in for a visit.

    You should be glad you didn't really understand all of what they were teaching or it might have been really confusing.

    Oh yeah, as an aside. I grew up in that group and I often felt like an unwelcome outsider, so you might have just been picking up on the ambient unwelcoming they roll out for anybody not in a old connected family.

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  8. I was part of that meeting, knew nothing of the funeral, or you... How could we make you feel like we wanted you gone, if we didn't know you were there? But as Kayla Jessop said:
    1- if I had known you were there, I would have said hello. I really don't think people were looking at you the way you thought they were. Self consciousness can do that to people, I know, I've been through it :) Also, I've been told that if you look at ANYTHING with a critical eye, you WILL find the faults you're looking for.
    2- Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, and John Taylor aren't the only prophets I personally revere and appreciate. There are 10+ prophets that I know of and love for their contributions to our group.
    3- the picture of Washington praying is a symbol that this nation was founded on God.
    4- I believe that if God wanted you to know what that talk was about, or if you were open to the spirit that was really in that room, then you would have known what it was about, because that wasn't what I got out of that talk, and I was in the same room, listening to the same Hispanic man, with the same "horrible" PA system.
    5- NO ONE on that stand would point fingers at you, and none of them did, I was right there. True, they did ask that people who weren't baptized wouldn't take the sacrament, but at that point, that meant me as well. I wasn't offended, why would you be?
    Over all, in my opinion, you weren't looking for the good, or open to the spirit, and you were feeling self conscious. So you were bound to feel unwelcome.

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    1. Part of this venture is to look at things with a critical eye, and I do find faults as well as positive things about all the groups I visit. No organization is perfect, and I'm doing an honest assessment of places as I visit them and the impressions I get from my visits. This was exactly how I felt and what I experienced. I am more than happy to listen to anything you have to say regarding your church. Feel free to email me if you wish to talk: smfm3712@gmail.com

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    2. Caitlin so if this guy was looking for good and open to the holy sprit he would have felt some thing and have been welcomed there? Are you saying your church welcomes people just as the main LDS church?

      I'm trying to figure out if most who go there have been born into that faith or if you welcome all who wish to learn and join.

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    3. I personally would... I know some persnickety people in the AUB as well as in the main LDS church... Every church has people who are less devoted, or less loving, or have the wrong ideas about how to do things, or all three... But one thing I live by is that the church is true, the people are not. We're not here for the people, we're here for the blessings associated with the things we try to do.
      I'm personally a more open and accepting person than a lot of people I know. So I can't judge the whole priesthood work by just my opinions. I personally love see, talk to, and accept new people, no matter what they believe, because that's the way God wants me to be. We're all his children, right?
      I would say though, that we do welcome people to come and learn, just a lot of times the things talked about at the pulpit are things that we've all studied for a while. Learning just from the things people talk about at the stand wouldn't get someone a good picture of this work. I know personally, the people who are better suited to teach the gospel.
      I'm not fully learned, but I try my best.

      BTW... Chad, you have two pictures up there of the back of my head. Stands to reason I didn't see you, you were behind me :p

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    4. Thank you for your response and I appreciate the time you took to type it. I fully agree that people will be people in any church that a person attends and a person does go to church because they feel it is Gods calling in their life. What you said kind of reminds me of the talk we had today at my ward. They were talking about how if one is living for them selves or to please others before God that it is an incorrect way of living. What I would add though, is if everyone is unwelcoming, I can say for sure my very young children and wife would not feel good going there. Good thing there is some welcoming people and it’s not about keeping out the out siders. I guess I was thinking of Warren Jeff’s and Colorado City as I cannot help but to remember seeing them closing out the outsiders. I know AUB is not like them though from what I have read :-)

      I attend the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints as a new convert and have been curious about the AUB. Yes, we are all Gods children :-) .

      Maybe one day when I move closer to Bluffdale Utah… if Gods will :-) .

      Hope you had a good Sunday .

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    5. I was talking to a few of my friends about this and they were saying that the only reason they didn't welcome the people that came was because they either didn't know they were there, or they're generally not social with people they don't know (yes, some in the AUB are shy just like in other places)... However, I know that nobody I know would purposefully make anyone feel unwelcome.
      So, if you need a friend, I'l be around :)

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    8. Does the Aub allow interracial marriages

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    10. The feeling of being un welcome is absolutely accurate. It's not just coming from a review, but from several people that have grown up in the group! Good thing being loved and your personal salvation doesn't depend on the low opinions and nasty looks that a very large portion of the members have and give. If looks could damn you, you'd have your one way ticket in No time going there. The way they work is either fake it till you make it or you don't fit in and get treated and talked about like trash.

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  9. I am so glad that you have come in and given outside look to the AUB. I actually have a similar experience as you did... And that church has my entire family in it other than a few people! Even having family in there... I know I'm not welcomed at youth activities because of some people... I think you got it right on the spot of how to describe the AUB.

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    1. Belle, talk to me. Im always here to welcome you to YOZ activities. Ill just send you a text when the next one comes. :)

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  11. Interesting observations. I feel like the reason you didn't understand the talk about dates of the "restoration of their priesthood" may have been because the speaker may have been talking about very specific events that allegedly took place in their own church's history, not the history of the LDS church. Most of which, speaking specifically of the "Lorrin Woolley story", is unknown by mainstream members of the LDS church. Things haven't really changed too much since we left in 1997. Thanks for the update. :)

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    1. I'm curious to know more about what the speaker may have been talking about. If you're willing to share with me, email me: smfm3712@gmail.com

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  12. Interesting perspective. I'm LDS and I had no clue they were actively trying to proselyte anyone including us.

    I may have to follow you through the rest of your Church tour.

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  13. Yup, that would be the AUB I grew up in. Never really fit in. But didn't really want to either. Interesting that not much has changed since I left.

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  14. Chad just a quick question how did you find out the hours of their service? Did you randomly just show up at a time you thought it would be or did you first contact them on the phone to find out? Did anyone see you taking pictures while on the property or did you have a camera out in the open that everyone could see. I ask this because I am thinking that may have caused people to shy away from you.

    It is a shame you didn't stay, for that would have made for a better read seeing if anyone came over to say hello.

    Thank you

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  16. Sister wives are a part of an flds sect and a smaller church of which they still follow their religion but are progressive. My five wives belonged to the AUB still live on church land but left the church because of its close mindedness and their very progressive values. So comparing this church to sister wives in any way doesn't fit though good descriptions were given

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    1. You are uninformed. The people from both'Sister Wives' and 'My Five Wives' are from the AUB. Not the FLDS. Though the people from 'My Five Wives' are disaffected.

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    2. You are uninformed. The people from both'Sister Wives' and 'My Five Wives' are from the AUB. Not the FLDS. Though the people from 'My Five Wives' are disaffected.

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  17. I was just curious if those of you that left are still practicing polygamy ?

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  18. MAM, you are wrong. Sisterwives belong to AUB. My Five Wives did belong to AUB, but are no longer practicing.

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  19. Hey Chad :) Im part of the AUB, I would love to talk to you and introduce you to the people here. One thing you would see here unlike any other polygamist group is that the men cherish the woman and respect them. The Gospel is all about Service. If you asked us for help we would do anything to help you, because we care about you. My Life is full i can have children that i can love and serve and give them the blessings i received from my loving parents. Thank you :)

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    1. Hey Jason, after much praying and consideration. How does one become a member??

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    2. You have to talk with on of the seventy.

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    3. "The men cherish the women and respect them" oh man that is the best joke I have read in a long time!!

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  20. I have a question, I read I believe it was on Wikipedia but I'm not sure that members of the AUB themselves do not call it a Church. If this is true, why then have I heard each one of the Browns on their show Sister Wives numerous times either call or refer to it as "their or our Church"?

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    1. Apostolic United Brethren (AUB) is a title used for the government.
      The (AUB) members see themselves as" Members of the "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints"

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  21. I have another question. Sorry, if you mentioned it somewhere however, I did not see it anywhere. You never mentioned what faith or religion you are and which you grew up in. I am just curious to know, as it helps for understanding. Thanks.

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  22. I would like to know if polygamy is illegal then technically the marriages are not valid, then why haven't the people been arrested for bigamy, I don't understand. We mormons in Australia, but religion here doesn't have a stronghold like it does in America,

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    1. Dear Christine,
      Your question is not uncommon. In most polygamous families, the man is legally married to only one woman and “spiritually married” to the others. The obtaining state marriage license (tax) had its roots in England. Marriage by consent and cohabitation is antediluvian.
      One of the functions of churches from the Middle Ages was to register marriages, which was not obligatory. In an effort to increase government revenue, England decided to tax marriage. England passed Lord Hardwicke's Act in 1753. This act instituted certain requirements for marriage; state registration, church consecration, and the performance of a religious ceremony observed by witnesses. The Marriage Act 1836 allowed the first civil marriages to occur. The Marriage Act permitted, a declaration by both spouse of their will the marry, before an official clerk of the civil administration, to constitute a legally recognized valid and effective marriage. Other European countries followed suit and instituted civil marriages.
      Polygamists feel that a government’s intervention into marriage is an usurpation of God’s authority. Therefore, government’s authority over marriage is disregarded, but, they are compelled to live per the laws enacted or face prison. Therefore, they marry and divorce per the civil laws of the land but do not pursue ecclesiaticle divorces. Hence, married to multiple women in God’s eyes but to only one woman in the govenrment’s eyes.
      To crush this loop hole in the United States, the Edmunds Act was created in 1882. It declared unmarried people living together as, “Unlawful cohabitation.” Prosecutors did not need to prove that a marriage ceremony had taken place (only that a couple had lived together). It had been a major tool used to prosecute polygamy in Utah.
      On July 13, 2011, the Kody Brown, a member of AUB, filed a complaint in United States District Court to challenge Utah's criminal polygamy law. On December 13, 2013, US Federal Judge Clark Waddoups ruled that the portions of Utah's anti-polygamy laws which prohibit multiple cohabitation were unconstitutional because it violated the family's freedom of religion.but also allowed Utah to maintain its ban on multiple marriage licenses.
      Citing Obergefell v. Hodges, where the U.S. Supreme Court documents state, “From the rejection of morality legislation in Lawrence to the expansion of the protections of liberty interests in Obergefell, it is clear that states can no longer use criminal codes to coerce or punish those who choose to live in consensual but unpopular unions. This case is about criminalization of consensual relations and there are 21st century cases rather than 19th century cases that control Homosexuality was a crime for centuries in this and other countries. Adultery and fornication were long considered crimes.”
      On September 25, 2014, the State of Utah appealed the ruling to the Court of Appeals for the Tenth Circuit. It is expected to fail considering the US Supreme Court has a ruling that appears to cover this issue. Who knows, the mainstream LDS may return to polygamy as well?

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  23. Can anyone tell me if there is a group AUB group in Germany. Is there one in Dortmund.

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  24. Can anyone tell me if there is a group AUB group in Germany. Is there one in Dortmund.

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  25. There is no AUB group in Germany, as far as I know. "Headquarters" are in bluffdale utah, with other branches in various parts of Utah, Arizona, Wyoming, Montana, and Mexico. All in the USA.

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  26. What time are Sunday services at the Bluffdale AUB?

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  27. I am not sure if I read this but does the AUB allow African Americans or other non-whites to join their religious sect?

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    1. African Americans:
      Baptism - Yes
      Marriage - No
      Priesthood - No

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    2. Well no offense but that isn't fair. Seems very white supremist to me. So never mind,

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    3. Mikeda I understand you!
      It is too complicated to explain it here on this site so please try to do some research about Mormon history.

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    4. Well i appreciate u getting back to me in that. Sorry about my previous response. It is completely different from other Christian beliefs that I have done research on. I was just taken back because most Christianity believes in welcoming all races without restriction. So it was just weird to me to hear that. I understand that African Americans can't get married or join the priesthood, I'm sorry for taking offense to it. But all my life I have been told that I can't do the same as a white person all because my skin is a different color. I am no different from the white woman across the street just different skin. But again thank you so much for answering my question I really do appreciate it. God bless you.

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  30. Please make it more clear that these are not traditional Mormons, but an radical group that broke away from the LDS church.

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    1. The Apostolic United Brethren (AUB) is a fundamentalist group and NOT a radical group.

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  34. Hello my name is johanna and iam interested to AUB and i want go there with bud i wonder how i can get contact with phone nummer or email i an grateful for answers.

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    1. Hello Johanna! Where did you come from? What would you like to know about the AUB?

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    4. Hello i am a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and has studied the Mormons, Mormon history, polygamy, etc.and I wonder if there are any email phone number to AUB because I am really interested and want to find out more if they Sincerely Johanna

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  35. Do I understand the above correctly? An african american can be baptized in the AUB church but can't be married by the church or become an active leader within the church?

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    1. Yes.
      They don't have problems with African-Americans they are no racists but in order of there believes no African- American can get merit or hold the priesthood. You have to understand the Mormon culture/ religion to understand this rule.

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    2. Do they allow interracial marriages

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  36. Does the AUB allow interracial marriages please reply

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  37. Thank you for replying to my question me and my husband are wanting to transition from monogamy to polygamy but we live in south Texas and there are no churches, groups, or even mention of such a thing so we are probably going to have to move from this state to one that's more familiar with the idea if you have any information or any churches near the Houston area please let me know jessicalaird23@yahoo.com I would really appreciate it. Thank you

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    1. You are wrong!
      EVERYBODY as the chance to enter the highest level!
      I don't have any problems with any kind of color, beliefs or any other orientation!!!
      I was not born or raised in the AUB!
      You call your self "Wandering Mormon" please study the Mormon doctrine and you will find the right answer -why and why not some options are available for some people-
      I know it doesn't sound fair but we have to see the whole picture.

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    2. I'm okay with not being a higher official I'm Hispanic and my husband is White we just feel the call to live a celestial marriage and to honor the old ways I just need more information if any one had to offer please let me know jessicalaird23@yahoo.com

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  39. ENGELSKA
    Hello I would really like to get in touch with AUB do not have a phone number or email I would like to talk to any representative from the church.
    Johanna

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  40. Would someone in the AUB be able to contact me with more information? I'm LDS and very much wanting to learn about the AUB. Thank you please email me.
    mariahlong59@yahoo.com

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  41. Hi Johanna and others interested in AUB. I am not LDS or Aub, but I looked up the contact details and although I didn't find a phone number or email address, I did find the Headquarters address,; so you can send them a letter. 3139 West 14750 South, Bluffdale, Utah 84065, United States of America. Current leader is Lynn A. Thompson. Blessings on your journey for truth.

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  43. #1- We were asked not to he answering questions via the internet. If you would like some help, attempt to contact a Seventy in the group. If you can't get a hold of one, then I guess you're out of luck unless someone wants to continue feeding you information despite the priesthood's request. In which case, they will be biased because they don't actually trust our priesthood and you won't be getting the information you really want.
    #2- African Americans are the only race that I am aware of, that have not been permitted to go beyond baptism. I could be wrong though. This is explained in the history of the LDS church. This applies to those even with a diluted heritage of African American blood lines.

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  44. Ok no offense but that's messed up. Wish talk the best anyways. God bless

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  45. Hello , Does anyone Still come to this Page ??

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  46. Helloo ? Is anyone Out there ?? :-)

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